Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

If you have a string instrument of any kind that needs fixing, a mistake you made in building a new instrument that you need to "disappear," or a question about the ethics of altering an older instrument, ask here. Please note that it will be much easier for us to help you decide on the best repair method if you post some pictures of the problem.

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Bryan Bear » Mon May 13, 2019 12:19 pm

This is going to be fun to watch. I can't wait to see how it turns out.
PMoMC

Take care of your feet and your feet will take care of you.
User avatar
Bryan Bear
 
Posts: 1151
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 1:05 pm
Location: St. Louis, MO

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Barry Daniels » Mon May 13, 2019 12:21 pm

Next step is adding some serious reinforcement to this neck. I am going to route out most of the ebony bar and install a 1/8" by 3/8" carbon fiber bar. Also installing two bars on the sides that are 1/4" high by 0.1" wide. Out comes the router jig and slots are cut.
Attachments
IMG_1464Resized.jpg
IMG_1470Resized.jpg
MIMF Staff
Barry Daniels
 
Posts: 2317
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:58 am
Location: The Woodlands, Texas

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Barry Daniels » Mon May 13, 2019 12:27 pm

I did a couple of modifications to my router I would like to show. I like having routers setup with a threaded feed so it works more like a vertical mill. So my Colt router in the plunge base got a Router Raizer setup. I also added a diy digital read out (DRO) that I made from a converted tire tread guage from eBay for about $7. This makes cutting a precise depth a breeze. Lower the router bit until it touches the work surface, zero out the DRO then turn the depth knob to desired reading. Let me know if you want more details on this.
Attachments
IMG_1467Resized.jpg
IMG_1465Resized.jpg
MIMF Staff
Barry Daniels
 
Posts: 2317
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:58 am
Location: The Woodlands, Texas

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Chuck Tweedy » Mon May 13, 2019 1:32 pm

So you are going for it - this will be fun - I second Bryan's post.
Questions:
- Are you not removing the neck? if not, why not?
- What are you going to replace the FB with? Braz or other rosewood?
- You are such a nerd! that router DRO is awesome!! (not a question)
Likes to drink Rosewood Juice
Chuck Tweedy
 
Posts: 1106
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 6:25 pm
Location: San Diego, CA

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Barry Daniels » Mon May 13, 2019 7:01 pm

1) At this point, I think it may not be necessary to remove the neck. Straightening the neck shaft may be sufficient to put the geometry right. I think it may have been reset back during the retop job in '76. After I get the carbon bars installed, I will measure the neck angle and proceed accordingly.

2) I have found some Amazon Rosewood from Allied Lutherie that is supposed to be very close in appearance to BRW. We will see when it arrives.

3) Thank you for the high complement (sincerely).
MIMF Staff
Barry Daniels
 
Posts: 2317
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:58 am
Location: The Woodlands, Texas

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Chuck Tweedy » Mon May 13, 2019 7:33 pm

thumbs-up.png
thumbs-up.png (4.51 KiB) Viewed 860 times
Likes to drink Rosewood Juice
Chuck Tweedy
 
Posts: 1106
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 6:25 pm
Location: San Diego, CA

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Barry Daniels » Fri May 17, 2019 11:11 am

Working on getting this neck reinforced. Cutting maple splines on my binding trimmer and getting ready to glue the three assemblies into place. I use West Systems epoxy fortified with chopped polyester fiber to make it a little stronger.
Attachments
IMG_1472Resized.jpg
IMG_1473Resized.jpg
MIMF Staff
Barry Daniels
 
Posts: 2317
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:58 am
Location: The Woodlands, Texas

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Barry Daniels » Fri May 17, 2019 5:00 pm

Got my Amazon Rosewood from Allied Lutherie and it looks pretty good. I would think BRW if I didn't know better.
Attachments
IMG_1474Resized.jpg
IMG_1475Resized.jpg
MIMF Staff
Barry Daniels
 
Posts: 2317
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:58 am
Location: The Woodlands, Texas

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Chuck Tweedy » Fri May 17, 2019 5:23 pm

that is beautiful rosewood!! Perfect.
Likes to drink Rosewood Juice
Chuck Tweedy
 
Posts: 1106
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 6:25 pm
Location: San Diego, CA

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Barry Daniels » Fri May 17, 2019 6:15 pm

Yeah, I am impressed. Never used it before. But this stuff has that xylophone ring when you tap it. And the dark chocolate color of old growth BRW.
MIMF Staff
Barry Daniels
 
Posts: 2317
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:58 am
Location: The Woodlands, Texas

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Barry Daniels » Sun May 19, 2019 10:21 am

Got the carbon and filler strips inlayed and leveled. The neck feels much stiffer.
Attachments
IMG_1476Resized.jpg
MIMF Staff
Barry Daniels
 
Posts: 2317
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:58 am
Location: The Woodlands, Texas

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Barry Daniels » Sun May 19, 2019 10:28 am

Once I started thinking about it, I realized that Chuck was onto something, "asking if I was going to remove the neck". Geometry does not require it, but refinishing and especially binding removal does require it. So out come the heat sticks. As soon as I start putting some sideways movement to the body (I have the neck elevated and secured in a vice) I noticed that one side of the dovetail is already loose! So this appears to be another cause of the floppy neck.
Attachments
IMG_1478Resized.jpg
MIMF Staff
Barry Daniels
 
Posts: 2317
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:58 am
Location: The Woodlands, Texas

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Barry Daniels » Sun May 19, 2019 10:37 am

The other side of the dovetail loosened up in about 10 minutes and the neck came out very cleanly.

I think Chuck must have become my muse (so to speak) because I started thinking about his suggestion to replace the sides. I would really prefer to be able to save the originals but there are a number of issues:
1) Five small holes at various places. Some of them still have hanging chads but other chads are missing,
2) The crushed area at the waist with extensive spiderweb cracks,
3) A large football sized patch near the neck heel that the previous repairman did with mis-matching wood that will need replacement, and
4) Having to remove the maple binding and patch it with matching mahogany strips.

This last issue is the straw breaking the camel's back. Removing and replacing the binding will be somewhat difficult and is not likely to give satisfactory results, no matter the effort. I actually am thinking that replacing the sides will be less work than saving the old ones. Not quite ready to pull the trigger on this so I think I will sleep on the idea and decide tomorrow.
Attachments
IMG_1479Resized.jpg
MIMF Staff
Barry Daniels
 
Posts: 2317
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:58 am
Location: The Woodlands, Texas

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Bob Gramann » Sun May 19, 2019 11:10 am

Barry, are the heatsticks the StewMac variety or did you make them yourself?
User avatar
Bob Gramann
 
Posts: 876
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 11:08 am
Location: Fredericksburg, VA

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Barry Daniels » Sun May 19, 2019 11:18 am

I made them. One fits into a soldering iron and the other fits into a shellac stick smoothing iron. I made them from 1/8" copper rods with brass or copper bushings on the end that fit into the irons. The copper rod is soft and it bends easily when they get hot, but I can bend them straight so it hasn't been a big problem yet.

I see that Stew-Mac has a way of hardening their copper rods, but I don't know how to harden copper.
MIMF Staff
Barry Daniels
 
Posts: 2317
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:58 am
Location: The Woodlands, Texas

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Bob Gramann » Sun May 19, 2019 11:27 am

I like that. Thank you. The StewMac one has been tempting me mostly because of the modern soldering station—my soldering tools are decades old. I have a reset coming up. It might be time to move away from steam.
User avatar
Bob Gramann
 
Posts: 876
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 11:08 am
Location: Fredericksburg, VA

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Barry Daniels » Sun May 19, 2019 11:59 am

I've done 3 neck removals with the heat sticks so far and they seem to work about as well as steam with the following advantages:

1) There is no finish damage created by the heatsticks, and
2) There is no need to seal up openings to keep steam from escaping, like in the photo above where the fretboard was removed and the gap between the neck and headblock was wide open.

I do, however, think that it is necessary to have two heatsticks, one for each side of the dovetail, because it is my thought that heat conduction from the heatsticks does not travel as far as hot steam does.
MIMF Staff
Barry Daniels
 
Posts: 2317
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:58 am
Location: The Woodlands, Texas

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Bob Gramann » Sun May 19, 2019 12:14 pm

I just ordered a couple of these: https://www.onlinemetals.com/en/buy/ber ... gLWevD_BwE
I’m going to play.

I’ve never done a reset with steam where I didn’t have more water and moisture than I wanted in some places. I could always deal with it, but I didn’t like it.
User avatar
Bob Gramann
 
Posts: 876
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 11:08 am
Location: Fredericksburg, VA

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Barry Daniels » Sun May 19, 2019 2:04 pm

That ought to work. Be interested in seeing if it holds up better than my soft copper rods.
MIMF Staff
Barry Daniels
 
Posts: 2317
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:58 am
Location: The Woodlands, Texas

Re: Restoration of a 1931 Martin 00-17

Postby Bob Gramann » Sun May 19, 2019 3:02 pm

Sorry to interrupt your fascinating thread (I always learn something when you do one of these), but I’ll ask one more question: Have you had any trouble making the edges of the 1/8” hole disappear? Did you plug it and sand it, fill it with sawdust and CA, or do something else?
User avatar
Bob Gramann
 
Posts: 876
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 11:08 am
Location: Fredericksburg, VA

PreviousNext

Return to String Instrument Repair: Practical and Political Issues

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

Your purchase from these sites helps support the MIMForum, but only if you start at the links below!!!
Amazon music     Amazon books     Amazon tools     Rockler tools     Office Depot    

The MIMF is a member-supported forum, please consider supporting us with a donation, thanks!
 • Book store • Tool store • Links •