Advice Needed - When should I install frets onto my neck?

[Jonathan Cressman]

Hello everybody,

I'm new to guitar building (and this forum!), and am just getting near the end of building my first guitar (a steel string), but want some advice on finishing the neck. Currently I have all the head stock work done, and the fingerboard is glued on and radiused.

My question is what should I do next - shape the neck or do the fretting? I had thought about doing the frets first, as it would seem to me that it would be easier to bang them in while the neck is still rectangular, and much easier to support. However, where I've looked online, it seems like most people install frets once the neck is already shaped, just before installing it on the guitar. Just wondering if there are special reasons for this, or if I would be fine to go ahead and fret, and then shape the neck after?

Thanks, any advice is much appreciated!

- Jonathan

[Andy Bounsall]

I’ve done it both ways but normally install frets before shaping the back of the neck. I find it’s just easier while the back of the neck is still flat.

[Bob Gramann]

I do it like Andy, frets before shaping. It’s easier. I do put the unshaped neck on the guitar and level the fretboard before I take it off and install the frets.

[Jonathan Cressman]

I do it like Andy, frets before shaping. It’s easier. I do put the unshaped neck on the guitar and level the fretboard before I take it off and install the frets.

That was actually another thing I was wondering about -I tried to be as careful as I could to sand perfectly evenly when I radiused the fretboard, but is that enough, or do you typically need to do more leveling work after radiusing? If so, how do you make it more level, while still keeping the radius?

[Bob Gramann]

In the quest for a perfect fretboard, I’ve found that gluing the fretboard (I use hot hide glue) to the neck makes the perfect less perfect. After I glue the fretboard, I let the neck sit for 10 days or so to allow the moisture in the glue to work its way out. I attach the neck (mine are bolt-ons) to the body using double-sided tape for the tongue. I scribble everywhere on the fretboard with pencil. Then, using a radius beam ( I really like the aluminum StewMac one), I sand until all of the pencil marks are gone. After removing the neck again, I fret. When the guitar is completed, fret dressing usually requires barely a kiss to the fret tops for leveling.

[Alan Carruth]

I shape the fretboard and fret the neck after it's glued on, I like being sure that really is the shape I want, at least for the time being....

Yes, this means that the inlays get done after assembly as well. And, yes, the neck is carved to shape and finished. In other words, fretting is one of the last tings I do.

[Peter Wilcox]

I flatten/thickness the fretboard blank, cut the slots, glue it on the neck blank, shape and carve the neck/heel/hradstock to final dimensions, radius the fretboard, deepen the slots as necessarys, install the frets, level and dress the frets, install side dot markers. These are bolt-ons, so all done off the body.

I don't know why I do it this way.

[Barry Daniels]

I have seen a perfectly straight fretboards move slightly after the back of the neck is carved. Not enough to make a huge difference and that can't be accommodated by leveling the frets. So either method is workable.

[Jonathan Cressman]

Ok, I think I can take out of this that it doesn't matter too much what I do first, so I should be ok to go ahead and fret, and then shape the neck afterwards.

Thanks for all of your advice everybody - it was very helpful!

[Sylvan Wells]

I agree with Alan. I fret the instrument after it is completely put together. As a matter of fact, fretting is the very last step in the completion of the instrument.

[Alan Carruth]

I would not say 'it doesn't matter' what order you do things in. It depends a lot on what your priorities are, and how you work.

I started put making classical guitars, using a variation on the traditional 'solera' method. The neck and top are glued together and clamped to a fixture. The guitar is then built around them. Fretting is necessarily one of the last things you do. Since the fretboard is dressed to shape after it's glued to the neck it's easy to avoid any issues with 'body hump, so there are advantages to working this way. It is normal to carve the neck after it's fretted, except for the heel, of course, so there is no danger of marking up the back of the neck when fretting.

These days I normally use plug-in necks, but I've stayed with the sequence of fretting after assembling the neck and body. Since thew neck is carved and finished at this point some extra care is needed, of course. OTOH, there's almost no chance of something moving after assembly this way, and you'e not pulling the end of a fretted board down onto the top, or ending up with a 'ski jump'.

In the end you pay your money and take your choice.

[Marshall Dixon]

I've been installing frets before gluing the fretboard on, and apply before shaping the neck. For classical guitars where I use a non-adjustable graphite truss rod I glue up with about 1/100" relief at the 5th fret, leveling and polishing afterword from the 1st to 5th then from the 5th fret to the end. For steel strings with an adjustable rod I straighten the neck to level and polish then add desired relief.

[Darrel Friesen]

I do it very similar to how Marshall does it and more or less how Mario does it. I usually use epoxy (Mario) for fretboard gluing as well before the neck is carved as per Benedetto. Works well for my low volume building.

[Marshall Dixon]

Here is a fretboard from a guitar in progress.

I check the width and depth of the fret slots with a tangless piece of the fret being used. I clamped this board overnight to try to force the frets to seat, and it helped some little bit.

Splits in the soundboard on the sides of the fingerboard are something to consider and to help deal with that I also use a 3" cantilevered heel block that is slightly wider than the fingerboard. I think that pounding frets in with the board glued down will result in the same stresses seen here and those will be introduced into the neck and body.

The extension on this was still severe and required too much force to hold it down, making for a cumbersome glue up, especially using HHG. So I put some relief into the underneath side and it straightens out with finger pressure.

[Barry Daniels]

There is a solution for the bowing that was first shown here by Mario. After fretting place 1/2" blocks under each end of the fretboard and clamp the middle down to the workbench. I know this sounds like it will break the fretboard but it won't. Leave the fretboard clamped down overnight. The next day the fretboard will lay almost perfectly flat and it will stay that way. I found that the clamp should actually be placed a little further down the fretboard because there are more frets there and it is bowed to a greater degree. I put the clamp at about the 10th fret.

[Marshall Dixon]

Barry, I tried that but with 1/4" blocks. As I said it helped some but 1/2" blocks would have helped more. I'll be braver next time. I bent the extension quite a bit after it was on the neck and clamped that overnight. It just didn't want to give in. I thought of putting a little moisture on the bottom hoping to warp it into shape, but figured the moisture would leave the wood after it was glued up and would deform anyhow.

[Barry Daniels]

Yep, the 1/2" blocks put a lot more pressure on the fretboard which is what is required to get the fret barbs really seated into the sides of the fret slot. First time I did it I was holding my breath waiting for the board to break but no problemo.

[Alan Carruth]

Marshall Dixon wrote:
"Splits in the soundboard on the sides of the fingerboard are something to consider and to help deal with that I also use a 3" cantilevered heel block that is slightly wider than the fingerboard."

I've been doing that for a long time; so far, so good. I make my 'chin' extension of the neck block 3" wide at the body end, and taper it down to 2-1/2" wide above the UTB. That way the edges of the chin don't run along a single grain line in the top, concentrating the stress.

[Darrel Friesen]

Yep, the 1/2" blocks put a lot more pressure on the fretboard which is what is required to get the fret barbs really seated into the sides of the fret slot. First time I did it I was holding my breath waiting for the board to break but no problemo.

I felt the same anxiety doing it the first time as per Mario. Worked great and have been doing it ever since with no problems.