KMG binding router 'clone'??

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KMG binding router 'clone'??

Postby Mark Parker » Tue Aug 27, 2019 7:25 am

Has any one picked up the manufacture of the KMG IA binding router attachment? Are plans available to make your own? It sure looks like the best solution to routing binding channels, especially on an arch top.
Fair Winds and Fair Tunes,
Mark (a veteran sailor and a VERY newbie luthier)
Mark Parker
 
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Re: KMG binding router 'clone'??

Postby Carl Dickinson » Tue Aug 27, 2019 2:47 pm

Why don't you ask about this over on http://acousticguitarconstructionforum.com/. That's the late Ken C's forum that is still being maintained by some of the long time forum members.
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Re: KMG binding router 'clone'??

Postby David King » Tue Aug 27, 2019 3:32 pm

http://harvestmoonguitars.com/kennethmi ... HMENT.html
The photos should give you all the detail you need to design your own version.
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Re: KMG binding router 'clone'??

Postby Mark Parker » Tue Aug 27, 2019 6:22 pm

Carl Dickinson wrote:Why don't you ask about this over on http://acousticguitarconstructionforum.com/. That's the late Ken C's forum that is still being maintained by some of the long time forum members.

I tried to join the forum, but no one has gotten back to me to 'approve' my joining. I'm guessing it is an inactive forum that we can just view.
Fair Winds and Fair Tunes,
Mark (a veteran sailor and a VERY newbie luthier)
Mark Parker
 
Posts: 28
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Location: Dublin, NH & Bocas del Toro, Panama

Re: KMG binding router 'clone'??

Postby Mark Parker » Tue Aug 27, 2019 6:24 pm

David King wrote:http://harvestmoonguitars.com/kennethmichaelguitars/BEARINGGUIDEDATTACHMENT.html
The photos should give you all the detail you need to design your own version.

Yeah, I was planning on giving that a go, but if anyone had actual plans with measurements, etc., it would save a bit of trial and error.
Fair Winds and Fair Tunes,
Mark (a veteran sailor and a VERY newbie luthier)
Mark Parker
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Tue Jul 30, 2019 7:19 pm
Location: Dublin, NH & Bocas del Toro, Panama

Re: KMG binding router 'clone'??

Postby Carl Dickinson » Tue Aug 27, 2019 6:26 pm

Check out the last post on this thread, http://acousticguitarconstructionforum. ... f=7&t=2179. Hans made one after he got burned out in the Sonoma County fires.
I believe John Parchem (Harvest Moon Guitars) is moderating the forum. Contact him.
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Re: KMG binding router 'clone'??

Postby John Clifford » Wed Aug 28, 2019 12:58 am

I have a simple method for routing archtop bindings. I do it on my router table. The guitar is supported by 3 spool clamps made from 3/4" plywood placed in a triangle around the edge. I made a sleeve from the same 3/4" plywood that fits over the bearing-guided router bit, so the guitar edge is supported at the same height where it contacts the bit. Then I just slide the guitar past the bit, skipping over the clamps, then move the clamps and finish those bits. Works great, very reliable. Of course you need a pretty large router table to support the whole guitar.
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Re: KMG binding router 'clone'??

Postby Marshall Dixon » Wed Aug 28, 2019 8:58 pm

I did as David King suggests... 3 times.Trying to make it smaller each time, as my shop space is limited. I'll post some pictures.

Two door hinges at the tail allow leveling of the sled and it is elevated to show the levelling adjusters underneath. One lower bout support is out to show placement holes for different sized guitars.

I used inexpensive ball bearing drawer guides for the runners and a 4 springs to provide the lift needed (as apposed to weights over a pulley which I'd used before). The UHMW plastic that rides on the top I cut from a kitchen cutting board and turned on a lathe. It's mounted with rivets because of their lower profile. The small piece of acrylic was cut from a larger piece that made several other fixtures. I used good Baltic birch plywood. Overall, not counting the router and bearing bit cutter, I probably spent less than $50 on this.

You can make some other router bit adjuster (easy to find on line) if you don't wan't to use the bearing followers.

I always use a climb cut and accurately scribe the inner edge with a purfling knife to prevent tear-out.
Attachments
binding jig-a.JPG
binding jig bottom view.jpg
binding jig and carrier.jpg
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Re: KMG binding router 'clone'??

Postby Brian Evans » Thu Aug 29, 2019 11:57 am

John Clifford wrote:I have a simple method for routing archtop bindings. I do it on my router table. The guitar is supported by 3 spool clamps made from 3/4" plywood placed in a triangle around the edge. I made a sleeve from the same 3/4" plywood that fits over the bearing-guided router bit, so the guitar edge is supported at the same height where it contacts the bit. Then I just slide the guitar past the bit, skipping over the clamps, then move the clamps and finish those bits. Works great, very reliable. Of course you need a pretty large router table to support the whole guitar.


I have an even simpler technique for archtops. My sleeve is the same height as the arch of the plate, I just spin it round resting on the belly of the arch, guided by my fingers stabilizing the edges. I did start out with the spools, but found they just got in the way.
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Re: KMG binding router 'clone'??

Postby John Clifford » Thu Aug 29, 2019 3:13 pm

Brian, you're gutsier than I am. I always go for maximum stability around routers.
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Re: KMG binding router 'clone'??

Postby Marshall Dixon » Thu Aug 29, 2019 9:44 pm

you all got me beat when it comes to guts.

Kent Everett wrote up something like this in American Lutherie years ago. He had two (maybe more?) routers mounted in a box with different preset cuts and indexed off several guides. As I recall he mentioned having the cut angled in about a degree at the bottom so the binding caught the groove better.

I'm not comfortable doing this blind. The first time I used a router I made the holder Jim Williams gives plans for in his book "Guitarmaker's Manual." That worked well, but requires a steady hand for 100% of the cut. I'm probably good for 96-97% but that last 3% always kills me.

I watched the video and it seems that the sled is the same height as the cutter guide. But I never got a good look at it. Is it just a round piece of plywood or MDF that the guitar sits on while you spin it?
Marshall Dixon
 
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Re: KMG binding router 'clone'??

Postby Mark Parker » Fri Aug 30, 2019 7:39 am

I just had what seems like a good idea. (It happens sometimes)I made my mold (the one the guitar sits inside, not the form for creating the arch) following Benedetto's book, so it is 2 1/4" tall. My sides are 2 3/4" tall (archtop guitar). When I was sanding the edges my sides and kerfing prior to gluing, I used a piece of 60 grit paper glued to a 3' long 2x12. I used a small 1/2" thick scrap to check that the sides were a uniform height above the form. Now that the top is glued on, I need to trim it flush and cut binding channels. Why can't I just make a new base, say 3/4" thick, under my router with a 'nose' like the KMG jig to ride along the edge? The new base will ride along the top of the form which is parallel to the top of the guitar so I won't need to index the arched top at all. For trimming the top, it will be easy - just use a bearing guided flush trim bit which I have. For the binding, I either need a set of the StewMac type cutter/guides which are a bit $$ or I need to make the router adjust on the base and use a 1/4" bit like KMG. Maybe if I just made a solid (non-adjustable) base set for the binding channel (tested on scrap and trimmed, etc.), then I could still use the flush trim bit as the roller will be doing the guiding, not the 'nose'. I'll have to play around with this and I'll post results when/if I get something working, but any thoughts/suggestions ahead of time are more than welcome.
Fair Winds and Fair Tunes,
Mark (a veteran sailor and a VERY newbie luthier)
Mark Parker
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Tue Jul 30, 2019 7:19 pm
Location: Dublin, NH & Bocas del Toro, Panama


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