repair / restore or refinish 1960's Gibson C-0??

[Basen Jacobs]

Hello, and what a cool forum!

So I have recently acquired a 60's vintage Gibson C-0 classical at a pretty discounted price, but it is not without its issues.

My main goal to have it as an everyday player, not looking for resale potential. I'm pretty handy with tools and have done some acoustic guitar repair in the past. That said, there are some semi-serious issues that need attention as follows;

1. Two repaired top cracks in lower bout on either side of bridge, basically going from the bridge to the end block. Ironically, upon removing the strings and investigating the cracks, it seems that someone has done a fairly professional job repairing them in the sense that there are two square spruce cleats with beveled edges glued at about mid point in the cracks. However, no one seemed to attempt to glue the actual cracks. Or perhaps the cracks hadn't opened up as much as they are now when the cleats were put in. Anyway, the top cracks need to be properly addressed.

2. Top crack from fret board (treble side) to sound hole. Pretty easy fix, easy to reach and see.

3. Decal rosette is peeling like crazy. Literally its just falling off. Strangely, I see the inlaid single black purfling line under the peeling rosette, and wish very much that the purfling line was all they did on this guitar. I guess that was the other model. Anyway, the rosette needs to be addressed.

4. Speaking of decals, the Gibson label inside is about to fall off. I'd like to reglue it, but I don't want to damage it - any ideas?

5. Reglued bridge: looks like the bridge has been reglued. Not a major issue, as it is tight and in the right place.

The Good: the neck is straight, good shape, original tuners, all braces seem tight, intonation is good, action is OK at 3/16" to the bottom of the low E on the 12th fret (would like to reduce that by about 1/16th or so, and there is more than enough saddle height to shave down), and in general the guitar is stable and solid with no major signs of abuse or physical damage.

I guess what I am trying to decide is if it makes sense to try to restore the rosette or if it makes sense to consider refinishing the top only. I would want to do it the right way; i.e. remove the neck and bridge and strip all the finish, glue the cracks and refinish. But then I ask myself if I should just go all the way and refinish the back and sides as well (there is considerable Gibson-style finish crazing all over the guitar. I used to like the character that gave, but perhaps my tastes are changing).

I'm also considering doing a nice figured rosewood peghead overlay and redoing the Gibson logo. I like the idea of the three or is is 5 piece neck, but that line of maple on the front just looks silly to me, and I think a nice rosewood overlay with a subdued Gibson logo would look so much better.

I guess I want it to look more austere, like a Martin classical and less like a Gibson student model. I guess that's the "political" struggle here. I'm attaching some pics of the cracks and rosette. I'm sure some people will be very familiar with this model, but I want everyone to see exactly what I'm up against.

[Michael Lewis]

Very likely the guitar was stressed, like someone falling with it and forcing the neck to cause the crack along the fingerboard, OR maybe it just got dried out and cracked. The crack along the fingerboard edge is a structural issue and should be addressed. Don't just put glue in it, it must be closed first, THEN glued and install cleats where appropriate. Usually cracks will close when the body is rehydrated, and that is a process of it's own.

I strongly advise against redoing the finish unless you are expert at such processes. It is VERY easy to make the guitar look worse and also very difficult to make it look better. Attend to the structural issues and maybe scrape off the decal rosette, and play it.

[Basen Jacobs]

Thanks Michael,

I agree with you on the fingerboard cracks and refinishing items; but with regards to the rosette, it's under the finish and the parts that are already missing are unfinished wood. so, removing the rosette would create a large unfinished ring around the sound hole. Unless a replacement decal was available the top of the guitar would look pretty bad until or unless the entire top was refinished.

[Michael Lewis]

Well, whatever you do will probably show that 'work' has been done in that area. Maybe the best thing would be to leave the rosette as it is. Even if you could find a replacement decal you would have to deal with the finish.

Usually instruments look better with honest wear rather than a finish repair that doesn't match the surrounding finish. If you are good at finish touch up work then I suggest you remove the rosette and deal with the finish, BUT if you are not fairly skilled in this I would leave it as it is with it's honest wear. I wouldn't suggest refinishing, the original finish looks mostly pretty good.

[Mark Fogleman]

If the old decal is something you can't live with and under lacquer, you can remove just the lacquer covering it, remove the old decal, re-apply a new decal to fit the area (here's a source: http://www.dukeluthier.com/Classical-Page-One_c23.htm ) and re-apply lacquer with good masking. Then level sand, polish with a small felt buff and compound on a hand drill and even out the sheen with the rest of the top with a non-woven abrasive pad

The paper label was probably applied with fish glue and can be reactivated by leaving a damp (wrung out) sponge on it until it loosens. (fish glue won't loosen with heat until >500f so heat won't help) Then dry for ~12hrs and any small wrinkles and loose places will smooth out and re-attach as it dries.

The light area around the label could be oxidized and darkened with a Potassium Permanganate solution, but I'm not sure you can get it that dark unless you treat the light area w/Tannic acid beforehand. As always test in a small spot before covering the whole area.

[Simon Magennis]

If it sounds ok, why bother? Just play and learn to love its used personality. I would be very surprised if anything with a decal rosette will ever be worth more than $100-$200 no matter what you do to it. Glueing up the open crack might be worth thinking about, but I would not bother with the already stable and cleated cracks.

[Basen Jacobs]

Thanks for your response guys.

I looked at the link for the rosette decals, and I think if I do anything as far as that is concerned it would be to remove what is there and either leave it, or refinish the whole top. Decal rosettes just aren't my style, and yeah.

Would the neck removal process for one of these be similar to other Gibson / Martin flat tops of this era, i.e. dovetail joint glued with hide glue? I think it needs a neck reset, and if I'm going through the trouble of that, I might just go ahead and refinish it as an everyday player without the decal rosette.

Also, did these originally come with the glued & screwed on bridges? I'm sure the repaired cracks in the lower bout were caused by the use of these screws. Not a very bright idea in my opinion.

[Mark Swanson]

Most "real" classical guitars would have a spanish heel construction, with the neck and neck block being one piece. Gibsons probably have a dovetail.