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DIY Tuning machine

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DIY Tuning machine

Postby Sascha Kreuzberger » Tue Mar 08, 2016 12:44 pm

Hi all,

I just start with some pics. The first shows two different Tuner of the same kind. The one that is mounted as a Head stock will get disassembled step by step in the following pictures. Im goin to describe the most important things a little later...

Just two things I should mention: the tubes that hold the Ballends still miss the holes to thread in the strings - but you can see those on the other machine. And I cannot show the slider/tuning knob today - but you can see an early version on the other machine.

have fun.

ImageSAM_0405 by linear tuner, on Flickr

ImageSAM_0406 by linear tuner, on Flickr

ImageSAM_0407 by linear tuner, on Flickr

ImageSAM_0409 by linear tuner, on Flickr


ImageSAM_0410 by linear tuner, on Flickr


ImageSAM_0411 by linear tuner, on Flickr


ImageSAM_0412 by linear tuner, on Flickr


ImageSAM_0413 by linear tuner, on Flickr


ImageSAM_0416 by linear tuner, on Flickr


ImageSAM_0418 by linear tuner, on Flickr


ImageSAM_0420 by linear tuner, on Flickr


ImageSAM_0421 by linear tuner, on Flickr


ImageSAM_0423 by linear tuner, on Flickr



questions welcome!

stay tuned
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Re: DIY Tuning machine

Postby Peter Wilcox » Tue Mar 08, 2016 2:56 pm

Very nice looking machines, but I am not clear how you turn the screws to tune it. I could see using a hex key or Allen wrench if the screws had those heads, but I can't see the heads in the pics. I assume the thing with a wooden knob is some kind of tuning wrench?

Great idea cutting a notch in the hex nuts for the ball ends. I look forward with interest to more explanation.
Maybe I can't fix it, but I can fix it so no one can fix it
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Re: DIY Tuning machine

Postby David King » Tue Mar 08, 2016 3:30 pm

It's a really imaginative use of off-the-shelf hardware to achieve a mechanical and aesthetic goal.
There is also a considerable amount of crafty handiwork displayed here.
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Re: DIY Tuning machine

Postby Sascha Kreuzberger » Tue Mar 08, 2016 4:42 pm

Hi,

I assume the thing with a wooden knob is some kind of tuning wrench?


Youre right Peter. The thing with the wooden knob is a hex key and the heads underneath the Brass Guide have those heads. I didnt want to open it cause I noticed that I fixed those two slotted screws very strong...thought I would ruin the screws...

It is one knob for all Strings. Some tiny neodyms pull the tuning wrench against the Brass Guide. When you Slide the wrench sideways
it will (forced by the Neodyms) slip into the next hole on the brass guide. This way you do not have to fumble around to find you way to the screws. A side benefit is the big knob that directly affects the gear ratio.

It's a really imaginative use of off-the-shelf hardware to achieve a mechanical and aesthetic goal.
There is also a considerable amount of crafty handiwork displayed here.


Thanks David!
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Re: DIY Tuning machine

Postby Jason Rodgers » Wed Mar 09, 2016 11:59 pm

I'm seeing all sorts of parts that are familiar from the little drawers at my local hardware store. I enjoy finding readily available parts as replacement for the "real" instrument hardware that is often sold at higher prices. This thing looks like something that I'd be almost crazy enough to attempt!
-Ruining perfectly good wood, one day at a time.
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Re: DIY Tuning machine

Postby Barry Daniels » Thu Mar 10, 2016 10:24 am

Be careful of using metal fasteners that are not hard enough to stand up to the wear and tear necessary in an instrument. I had one student who insisted on making his own truss rod using a hardware store bolt welded onto the end of a bar. The rod worked but only a couple of times. He quickly stripped it out and then had to remove the fretboard to replace it.
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Re: DIY Tuning machine

Postby David King » Thu Mar 10, 2016 1:53 pm

That's a sad story indeed but I've seen it happen so often on Fenders that I'd say the problem is more generalized than cheap hardware from Asia. It's the reason I cut my truss rod threads with an adjustable die until the nut just fits. When I'm a little less busy I'll start cranking out my own brass hex nuts with a high tolerance thread. The acorn nuts I get from Allparts aren't particularly accurate on the outside dimension and at least one customer has managed to strip the flats off with the correct box wrench.
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Re: DIY Tuning machine

Postby Sascha Kreuzberger » Fri Mar 11, 2016 7:05 am

Hi all,

thanks Barry and David for your comments! Relating to the screws and nuts wich hold the strings there wont occur any problem, as the screws just hold a single string each.The screws/nuts comply with industrial standards (which I suppose is not the case with common guitar/bass Hardware). What should be carefully considered is the steel bar that holds all screws - particularly when the construction gets wider (string spacing) and/or the number of strings increases.

The fasteners just have to deal with tractive forces (hope thet might be the right term) if mounted / adjusted correctly.

On a truss rod meet different kinds of forces on a heat treated (welded) tiny place - very complex situation...

cheers
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Re: DIY Tuning machine

Postby Barry Daniels » Sat Mar 12, 2016 8:49 pm

My point is that most hardware store screws, nuts and bolts are not hardened steel. They are made to be installed once and they will not hold up to constant use. But there are bolts and nuts available now that are better and harder steel and some of the better hardware stores carry these in addition to the common fasteners.
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Re: DIY Tuning machine

Postby David King » Sun Mar 13, 2016 12:50 am

Barry,
I use hardware store brass 4-40 screws that definitely aren't hardened and many hundreds have now been in service since the early 1990s pulling bass strings up to pitch at 40-50 pound loads. I've never had or heard of a failure but I had several Yamaha XB headless basses in for repair that used large M4x.50 threads custom made in hardened steel that failed miserably even though they would have been rated for nearly 1000 pounds of tensile strength. Yamaha's mistake was to use the same steel alloy in the mating parts which caused galling, excessive wear and premature failure.
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Re: DIY Tuning machine

Postby Barry Daniels » Sun Mar 13, 2016 10:34 am

Brass contains a bit of lead which makes them sort of self lubricating, so they are a different story from steel hardware. They are definitely not very hard but they can stand up to constant use sometimes much better than steel hardware. I use brass nuts on my single-action truss rods and have never had a problem.

Strange thing about the Yamaha basses. Steel is a very unusual material and there are a lot of factors at play that effect various properties. And what works in one application may fail in another.
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Re: DIY Tuning machine

Postby Hans Bezemer » Tue Mar 15, 2016 5:48 am

I'm a bit late to the party, but I really like these tuners.
As said above, good use is made of commonly available stuff.

Hans
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Re: DIY Tuning machine

Postby Sascha Kreuzberger » Wed Mar 16, 2016 2:32 am

Hi Hans,

actually it's me who is a bit late ...as I didn't manage to make the ad ons the unit needs to work with a multiscaled instrument - prior to your appearance!

best
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Re: DIY Tuning machine

Postby Jerome Hess » Tue May 03, 2016 2:02 pm

sacha those are AMAZING!

I love the work, and the whole steampunk/diy feel is great.

did you do the metal work yourself?

is that a B bender at the back?

Ever thought of creating your own Brian May style authentic TREM?

I want to build a Red Special as authentic as I can but the only guy (in the world) who makes a copy of that trem is in South America and s asking $265 + p/h

now I know its probably a LOT of work, and the end result is really unique, but I think that's a tad high?

And actually I might even be willing to pay that, but in email contact he is NOT very customer friendly :roll:

j
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Re: DIY Tuning machine

Postby Jason Rodgers » Tue May 03, 2016 3:34 pm

Jerome Hess wrote:I want to build a Red Special as authentic as I can but the only guy (in the world) who makes a copy of that trem is in South America and s asking $265 + p/h

now I know its probably a LOT of work, and the end result is really unique, but I think that's a tad high?

And actually I might even be willing to pay that, but in email contact he is NOT very customer friendly :roll:

j

Well, considering that Allparts sells a Gotoh locking trem for $180, a Schaller for $215, and Floyd Rose for $325, $265 for a hand-made copy of a very specific component doesn't look too bad.
-Ruining perfectly good wood, one day at a time.
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Re: DIY Tuning machine

Postby Sascha Kreuzberger » Tue May 24, 2016 8:07 pm

Hi Jerome,
..and sorry for the late answer! and thanks for commendation. Yes, i did it all by myself...just using files, a Hack/Jabsaw and a box column Drill...

I found some different pix/plans os the rs trem, but all In all I think it's not a big deal if you manage to get your Hands on on " close to authentic" plans. The Rollebridge could be a bit tricky...

Are you experienced workin with metal/ steel?

Regarding the price...hmm I agree, it's ok for a handmade Gear,...on the others Hand, you could build lots os rs trems if you do it yourself (and learn a lot!) . Could you Hyperlink a Plan/Sketch or Pic?

Sascha
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